PartnerUp #120: WTF Is Happening In B2B Sales Right Now?!

What is up PartnerUp!

This week, Jared and Issac dive into everything going on in B2B sales right now. To put it bluntly, s*** is hitting the fan - and everyone knows it.

How come everyone is problem-aware but solution wary? If you’re a partner pro, you have a huge opportunity to bring Nearbound plays to the table and generate increased revenue for your company.

Jared and Isaac discuss the hundreds of conversations they’ve been having in the market. These conversations have led to the development of the Nearbound Blueprint for driving revenue NOW using partner intros, intel, and influence.

Listen in to find out more!

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  • Living in market vs. living in Partner land. 0:00
    • Isaac has some good ideas on how to bring it all together.
    • The Nearbound concept narrative strategy.
    • Living in the market vs. partner land.
  • People are problem aware. Solution weary. 3:35
    • People are problem-aware, solution-aware. Weary. Jared.
    • Cognitive dissonance. Groundhog Day for months.
  • The problem with lying about hitting your numbers. 5:54
    • Cynics, cynics, detached from the world of reality.
    • Tactics without strategies, noise before defeat.
    • We are bridging the gap between strategy and tactics.
    • Too many things on the sales team's plate.
  • Layers of tactics in specific areas. 11:41
    • Layering tactics in specific areas.
    • People are problem-aware, solution-weary, and are ready for this change.
    • How to get real fast with people.
    • The three-step sales process.
  • How to scale up partner sales activities? 17:26
    • Outbound sales is 40% and partner sales is 10%.
    • Partner sales activities.
  • Tapping into what’s already in your ecosystem. 20:14
    • Every partner is a commercial partner.
    • Every connection is a connection to potential customers.
    • The Nearbound sales blueprint.
    • The Neabound summit is the resistance.
  • The blueprint is the answer for bridging partnerships and sales. 25:17
    • The blueprint is the answer to the test for partnerships.
    • Partnerships are different than sales.
    • A tool to bring in more than just you.
    • Get some frickin w's on the board.
  • The importance of having a board of directors. 30:41
    • Non-profits have a board of people.
    • The importance of having a board.
  • The reason why I’m dying on this hill. 33:03
    • The partnerships moment is here and now.
    • One moment, one opportunity, one rep.
    • Partners are genuinely part of the solution for their companies.
    • The partners intro is the hardest one.
  • How to get to scale. 37:02
    • How to get things to scale.
    • How to start with a qualitative question.
    • Designing the perfect partner and ecosystem roadmap.
    • Partner sourcing dollars in deals.
  • Nearbound marketing and marketing day. 42:13
    • The blueprint is available for free on
    • The Nearbound Summit 2023.
    • Chris Walker is the most prolific content creator in B2B marketing.
    • Partnerships are a strategy, not a department.


Jared Fuller 0:00
The whole right, what is up partner up? We're back. Isaac, I think this is episode 120. Right?

Isaac Morehouse 0:11
I have no idea to be honest, I had no idea

Jared Fuller 0:15
was what 19 was Scott Pollack, I did near bounce school with him. So like you weren't on that one got my partner in crime back. That shout out to Scott and Fernando, for letting us publish that episode because it was a I had a great conversation just explaining he was like, what WTF is nearby? Like, Jared, can you explain this to me? And went through and it was like, the most comprehensive conversation I've ever had on what is nearby. And so I think was a great combo. But, Isaac today, you had some good ideas on how to bring this all together?

Isaac Morehouse 0:48
Well, well, yeah. Because I, this is some stuff that like you and I have talked about here and there in bits and pieces. But I wanted to just like, ask you straight up this concept of near bound, right, which essentially boils down to tapping into those your buyers trust for Intel intros and influence at every step of the buyers journey, right. This is not a concept that like, came from on high from an ivory tower that anyone would, this is something that emerged over the last year and a half of living in market and just talking with people and seeing these continual trends. People are saying things in different words, they're all kind of the same thing or pointing in the same direction, about where the markets at where their sales and marketing and you know, their go to market orgs are at what is not working, and what seems to be promising. And all that kind of coalescing, kind of the result of that is this near bound concept, narrative strategy. But I want to hear like, right now, you have more conversations in, like almost anybody out there with CROs with with revenue leaders, essentially. What are they saying? And like, Why? Why is this connecting, but then there's a follow up? Why is it connecting conceptually, but for most of them still failing to translate into tactics?

Jared Fuller 2:14
I think this is going to be such a fun combo for everyone to dive into today. Because that's like, my favorite thing to do is like, kind of aggregate and share, like what's actually happening. You know, I call this living in market. So if you're in sales, you live in market a lot, you just you have a more myopic view. So if you're living in partner land, you should be living in market a lot with a more expanded worldview. But you might be able to, like not translate that into success on the front line, because you're disconnected from sales. So it's been fun being able to like, be in these conversations. During this really challenging time where Isaac, I've never seen a market, maybe we should address this from the onset. I've never seen a market that was so ready for change. And so scared and terrified of change. At the same time, like, people are hurting, like this is a tough market folks. Like we're not listening to this and to be like, everything's amazing, you know, hunky dory. It's like, No, this is the toughest sales market I've ever seen. And keep in mind, I got into the space right at the peak of the Oh, eight crash. So like, I've seen a crash a big one. It it's far worse. It's a far worse selling environment. Okay, so then, what am I hearing in the field, then? I think at a fundamental level, we should address that. People are more open to change than ever, but they're more skeptical of like which thing to do, as a result of it.

Isaac Morehouse 3:35
We'll call Jared we'll call this people are problem aware, solution weary. That's what it seems.

Jared Fuller 3:42
Yes. That's a great framework. I love that clip. That one, problem aware, solution. Weary is a great way of describing that. So I got this VP of sales enablement, I won't asked him yet. That shot me a LinkedIn DM the other day. So again, not a partner person, not even as the CRO VP sales enablement. And he was like, Look, I've been reading your stuff, and listening to you. And I just had this meeting with the entire C suite. So head of sales at a marketing had of success, and you know, ops, finance, whole whole shebang. And I said, fellas, ladies, we've been sitting here like it's Groundhog Day for months, and months and months and months. And I want to ask everyone here a question. You know, inbounds dipped a little bit. We can't really spend that more but we think we can hold. So we're saying we need to get more outbound activities. And I just have a question. Does anyone in this room believe if we hit 100% of these ridiculous outbound activity targets that we'll get to the number? No, no. So then what the heck are we doing? Like, he was like, he messaged me like all caps. You know, I have to figure out these near bound plays. And that's why I've been on this like tangent and rant about this topic. Because I know that because everyone's so like, you know, the openness to change component is like, you know, their problem aware. But then the solution where he is like, the exactly that, that for months, they've been doing Groundhog Day, right? Like nothing's working, nothing's working. Okay, hit the bad activity targets hit the outbound activity targets. It's this weird cognitive dissonance. But if we can figure out the path forward through this, I think we have an incredible opportunity for the the winners in this market.

Isaac Morehouse 5:39
You know, what this reminds me of Jared, the stories that you would hear from, like, the Soviet Union, when, when you have the meetings, and you're like, or, you know, Maoist, China. Okay, everybody report on who's gonna hit their numbers, you know, their big giant production numbers. And everybody's like, Oh, yeah, we're gonna hit ours, we're gonna hit ours, because they're like, if I say, we're not going to, I'll get like, called the Outback or like, sent to the Gulag, or something. But we all know, every single worker knows everyone in the room is lying. But we just haven't gotten to the point where, like, it's this weird environment where you feel like you have to keep pretending. Even though you know, and then and that's what does that kind of environment do? It creates cynics. It creates cynics. It creates people who are detached, the world of reality is something different from the world that the face that they have to put on. And when your company starts to get that way, when we all have to put on a face where we're going to pretend like yep, these are numbers. Okay, what are we going to do? Oh, we're gonna do these activities. But secretly, everyone's like, we all know that's not gonna work. Like, no, that's a really it's a, it's a it's an unhealthy thing. versus you know, if you ever see those tweet threads, usually it's like, it's usually it's like Bootstrap type companies, or like smaller companies where they'll, they'll be like, Hey, we just hit like our first $5,000, in MRR and the walk through every detail of earning, like the three customers that they have. And you're like, well, that doesn't seem very brag worthy, but but the fact that they're so honest about it, I've even seen podcasters do this, where they'll publicly share like their sponsor dollars. And there's something about when they're really small amounts, but they're just, like, unafraid to talk about the reality. There's something that it's so refreshing, it's like, if you ever sit down, I sit down with my wife, we go over budget, spreadsheets don't lie, it's like it hurts at first, because you're like, okay, all these assumptions we're making about what we're going to do next, you know, repairs to the house this then let's actually look at the numbers can't We can't, it hurts for a minute, but then it's so freeing, because you're like, now we are on a new reality. We're starting at a new basis. That's realistic, what can we do? And I feel like we haven't quite gotten to that place, yet. People are still in the phase where they're like, they know it's not going to work. But they're not willing to throw out the old assumptions entirely yet.

Jared Fuller 8:02
But see, what was the what was the Sun Tzu quote, It was tactics, without strategies, the noise before defeat. And I think that's what a lot of people are missing right now is that there's a lot of tactics out there. And, you know, strategy by itself is like, I would say, it's like the, you know, solution where he component, there's a lot of strategies as well, like, JLG, right? So like product lead growth, it's like well done, like, make it easier for people to like, experience your product, like okay, table stakes, like strategy, but like that's devoid of, let's say, sales tactics. What the heck does my rep do tomorrow? Or even like, EOG, which, you know, I was savannah of like, ecosystem, lead growth, go to ecosystem with Allen, like, all of these things make sense? How do we bridge that gap, like, between strategy and tactics, that people go, Okay, here's this new way. And here's how I can do something. Now. phrases that are working right now. That like everyone is agreeing to is weird for this time. Isaac is like every plant I walk into, I'm like, Alright, let me let me see if I can help here. And for 45 minutes in the call, you might have a VP of partnerships, that what I'm encountering is so scared of making their program work. What do I mean? It's like, every single thing that is an opportunity for them to like, really go hang their hat on. And let's say take some personal risk to like, be the person that their company can count on right now. Because I think that's the other thing is, I think you all listening, have the opportunity and the responsibility and risk of being the person your company can count on right now. But I have these calls and what happens 45 minutes into the call, they're like, Yeah, but there's so much happening under the hood here. Like I'll hear that phrase, right? There's too much going on behind the curtains. There's too many things on the sales teams plate right now. There's enablement, we just launched a new product feature we brought AI in the amount of excuses that I hear from heads of partnerships. which are valid or invalid, whatever your take on any of these things are, is like, it's remarkable. It's It's like they're not seeing that their company has been has never been so open to change. But they're just as scared as that CRO is. And it's like, do you guys both? If they're both aware of the same problem, and they're both just as terrified, the sales leader is just as terrified. And so as the VP of partnerships,

Isaac Morehouse 10:24
yeah, it's funny in from the leadership standpoint, I think the, you know, the, okay, here's all these alternative strategies floating around status quo isn't working great, we understand that we're missing our numbers, we're not seeing the, you know, a way that we're going to hit those under the status quo. So now, there's all these people out here kind of floating these new strategies. And the thing that I think from a leadership standpoint you look at, especially in a down market is when I hear a new strategy, a new go to market, I think okay, so this is like a reorg. Right? Okay. So we're gonna reorder, we're going to spend six months reordering everything. And then we still don't know if it's going to be any better. I'm not ready to do yet that yet. That's the like, solution, weary part, or you have the opposite extreme, which is just a handful of tactics and be like, Sure, let's just try a bunch of random tactics. But we're not like really committed to those. It's like a grab bag of like, what happened, we tried. And I think what's really landing correct me if I'm wrong, is there's something about bringing this near bound framing to the picture? That's like, No, you don't have to do a reorg. This is your existing organizational structure and your existing motions. They add a little bit of a layer on to it, which probably already lives in your partnerships department, but it's just not being brought into play. And you're layering some tactics in some very specific areas. What what I found Jared, I've, I've been on a handful of calls where people have been like, like, literally, somebody booked a call with me last week, saying, How do I get an airbag strategy going? I'm running partnerships over here. How do we do this? How do we bring it to the sales organ? You never? And I was like, what if we, I'm like, let me just ask you this. If this sounds better, what if we chunked it down? And we just said, who's our very best partner that we have a great relationship with? We love working with, we got a lot of overlap there. How can we how can we do this month or this quarter? How can we get involved in three deals with them? How can we pull them into some deals that they have influence on? Or vice versa? How can I get one or two of my sales reps? to tap into this one partner for a couple of deals this month? Like what if we just boiled it down to that and got just really focused? Does that sound like so? Because Because the idea is like, well, I have to get all this internal buy in, I gotta get all these people aren't sure. And I'm like, you don't need any buy in for that. If you're like, hey, here are these three deals, I got this one partner that's in that's in these three deals. Here's what I want to help you guys do this month or this quarter, to try to move this deal. And then like, let's see if it and it's kind of this interesting. Yes, it's change. But it's not reorg. And hope that it gets better. It's like layer on to the current processes, the current org chart, a few motions that are already kind of like waiting in the wings. I don't know. Does that does that sound like something that you're encountering out there? That's what I've kind of seen.

Jared Fuller 13:17
It's what you just said is exactly the same as like, people responding to crawl Walk Run right now. Yeah, that's it, right. Like, I was just talking to Judd from GTM partners, right before we hopped on the pod. And he's like, you know, ironically, things like, you know, let's call it. Readiness Assessments are like back end style all of a sudden, because why it's exactly what you said people are problem aware, solution weary. Like, are we ready for this change. And that doesn't mean that you don't get to start at all. So like, when the conversation I was having with jet is like, look, you're you're saying that the market is leaning into things like, you know, GTM partners, kind of like Topo, Gartner for b2b Right? So they're, they're really trying to like understand the current state of GTM. And what's so interesting is we're all talking about this very similar thing is that people are problem were solution weary. And what that means is you need to provide a framework that has some like, crawl, walk, run, how trite is that? Well, literally like that 45 minute call with that VP of partnerships that did not want to make any change to like, get to the other side with their sales team. It was like we have to wait on all these things. I'm like, well, then what are you doing for the next year? Who kind of like you're just running the status quo, like nothing's gonna get better. And then I was like, what if I helped you build a crawl Walk Run plant where it was like we do this bucket first. We do that bucket second and we do this bucket third. Immediately she was like, Well, okay, well, we can do that. Now. I don't think the conversation changes my framing change that is like we need to right size this but you're committed that you don't have a solution in place.

Isaac Morehouse 14:55
So when you're having when you're having conversations and talking about you know, I've seen you do this, but for Jared, I think it's a brilliant way to to, to get real fast with people is like, Okay, what's your number? What do you have to hit? And then are you going to hit it? And then you kind of move to this interesting question about revenue mix. You know, what is your what is your sales math? What? What are you expecting your outbound and inbound to do? And then most people you're like, Do you have a third category? Do you have revenue that you expect to be indirect or from partners or whatever you might call it? And it's often like a little bit vague. But like, and then you kind of I've seen you use this as a jumping off point to say, look, if you if you can, if you're telling me right now, I know we're not going to get this much from inbound and outbound? How are you going to make it up? I even going to try to make it up. What are you getting from your near bound revenue from partner sourced? Is the ROI Good? Then, okay, now tell me how much of your resources you're devoting to these three things. And it's like, the resource allocation is way out of whack. And that's where the conversation starts, like, well, if you're serious, you know, you're not going to hit it with outbound and inbound, you're getting a better ROI on this near bound bucket, but you're putting the least resources into it. Maybe it's worth at least trying to get that up to, like, Tell me about that conversation. Where does where does that go? Because I've seen you kind of use this math thing, this this, you know, sales math thing. And I think I think that kind of I think that's a way of like helping people be like, you're right. I do need to change something like that's where people start to say, Okay, now let's get tactical.

Jared Fuller 16:35
I was skeptical at the beginning of this to even bring up like, like all the things that we could talk about. I was like, Isaac suggested, Why don't we just talk about what's happening in market? I'm like, yes, let's do that. Like, and what things have I been learning out loud with you all, you know, listening, this is one that I've never been so geeked out on and excited about, because it's working. So would you say you've heard this Isaac, like, I tend to be a broken record. Like if I have to find something that works, my brain does not allow me to not find something that works and that I do the same thing over and over again, simple, simple guy. Here's the thing is that I wouldn't frame the question outbound inbound, near bound up front, I would say outbound inbound and inland, let's say partner, here's the common phrase that I'm hearing. Hey, right now, today, we're about 50%, inbound. But it's drying up, you know, more and more. Like it's not getting more of our mix. And we're not growing the demand side, right? Outbound is about 40%, and then call partner give or take 10% You know, in a lot of organizations, and that varies tremendously, like talking about a customer last week, it was doing 73% partner. So they were like, how do we how do we scale this in, like, grow it? Right. So there's varying ends of the spectrum. But the point was this. When they said, let's call 10% partner, you know, they weren't really confident in that number. It was like, okay, cool. Well, next question, do you or 10% of your sales team's activities, partner sales activities? And that's like a shocking question to the CRO and most of the time, because they're like, Well, I'm not sure what what do you mean? Well, are your partners engaging? Are your sellers engaging? Let's say, areas of influence around target accounts? Are they engaging partners or other customer? How are they breaking into those accounts through whatever you call that partner bucket? Or is this these are only referrals or deals or OPT, these are leads that are coming from the partner team? And they'll typically say the ladder. Right? So these are leads or referrals or deals that are coming from the partner team. Okay, so you've you've just told me that your number was 100 million for the year, you're not going to make it you have a $10 million gap. You know, 10% is coming from partner, it sounds to me like you need to make up another 10%. So like, if you could get partner to 20%. Maybe you have a shot at hitting the number? Yeah. Well, correct me if I'm wrong. But if I wanted to hit 20% partner, that means that 20% of my accounts, must have a partner attached. And the 20% of my sales team's activities should be partner sales activities, like it's math, not magic. I don't see as pulling rabbits out of hats. You know, like, that's the honest to god exactly what I've been saying. And I'm like, assuming that like, even though we know that outbound activities, inbound activities, and let's call them near bound activities, don't all have the same sales math. At minimum, we could agree as a test. That that's a fair assessment. Right? So what that means is if you're already doing 10%, then can I get another 10% of accounts where we commit that the top 10 accounts that have the best partner, you know, relationships and overlap, heck, customer relationships, I don't care what they are, where you're gonna go near bound in run these plays into How to influence intro against them. Do you believe that that 10% of activities at the 10% of accounts 20%, whatever that number is, are going to be more effective than the outbound activities? And the answer is every time Yes. So what are we waiting for?

Isaac Morehouse 20:20
What I think is, is so powerful about this is it's, it doesn't require some crazy new thing. It's it's not it's not betting on something outside of your control to happen some magic to happen. Well, maybe if we run this campaign, and it really works well. And we drive a bunch of leads. It's like, given what's already in your ecosystem? Can you close more deals, by tapping into what's already there, for Intel intros and influence? And I thought of this yesterday talking to a partner Pro, who said that their leadership is like, trying to get them to break everything down into commercial and non commercial partners. So like, who are the ones that are commercial partners that are actually going to like drive business and who are the non commercial partners? And right, and I was like, every partner is a commercial partner, because every partner probably has connection to some of your opportunities, potential customers, that you can tap into if you if you're doing it, right, you have a healthy relationship, and it's reciprocal. You tap into them for that Intel interest and influence like to say, it's like when it's like when, you know, young people will say like, oh, I don't, I don't know anyone. I don't have any connections. So it's hard for me to get a job. And it's like, everyone knows people and your network is richer than you think. How many people have you asked, maybe they know someone that you didn't know that they knew. It's, it's sitting there. Every connection is a commercial connection, every connection? Is it like, you can't think that way and say, like, well, who's sending us referrals right now? Right, like just just sending us a steady stream, and we're just waiting to receive?

Jared Fuller 22:08
Are you sending referrals right now? Great, right? Or your, you know, like, just, that's what I've been saying directly? Whatever. Yeah, I hear that. I'm like, Wait, how many are you sending? Okay, stop that. Like, you can't start there. Because that's just not the way that business is where people don't just lightheartedly send, you know, I'm gonna wake up today think about someone I hadn't thought about forever and send a referral. Yep. Yeah, not, that's not really the way that that works.

Isaac Morehouse 22:33
Yeah. So like running that play, just recognizing, hey, we got a whole bunch of employees, a whole bunch of customers, a whole bunch of partners, we got all these relationships already in our network that are surrounding buyers at various points. How do we go and start tapping into that and bringing it in? And that and that's where the how do we do it? That's where I feel like you have, you've really started to nail that Jared. And you put together this blueprint, which I believe when this episode goes live, I think the blueprint will drop to tomorrow, if you're listening to this on what the 18th the near

Jared Fuller 23:10
bounds sales blueprint, baby, yeah, like this is the ultimate like, hard piece of content to like figure out and create.

Isaac Morehouse 23:17
This is like a year and a half of living in market and learning out loud. Mostly being done, like through through Jarrods brain coming into a really tight form that includes like the specific tactics, okay, Intel intros and influence from people that have, you know, trust of your buyers. What does that mean? And breaking down? Okay, here's an example of exactly how you find who influences your buyer, how you decide if you want to ask them for Intel intros or influence? How do you ask them? How do you ask for an intro? What's the most effective process? Who's doing the ask? What's the frickin email template they're sending, right? Like breaking down and getting tactical and showing how this layers onto your existing processes. And this is where like, partner managers, partner pros, were the bulk of the audience for this show, like, you have, like, we like to say, for the for the near bound Summit, you are the resistance, right, like, we're in, we're in a dystopian, you know, Terminator, landscape, future, or at least it's coming. But you actually have the answers, you actually are sitting on the thing that can break through, you have that. And now is a time where your company is looking for that. And you have the ability to answer that call and to bring that in and to say, hey, I can help us solve these problems by bringing in more influence more intel more intros from our network of partners. It's already there and like you kind of hold that key. It's like a, it's like a brutal challenge. Yeah, look at the landscape ahead of us. But it's an amazing call. Call to action and call to adventure is well, it's like in the movies when you find out that like, you know, you didn't you never knew that your parents were actually some sort of superheroes. That's like, well, that's cool. But then it's also like, oh, I guess what the world is about to end and you're the only one who can stop it. You know, because of these powers you didn't know you have. That's kind of what I feel like we're Parker, people are sitting right now.

Jared Fuller 25:19
Absolutely fitting for this environment. I think I wrote in the blueprint, someone reacted to me the other day was like, I got chills when I read that I've been sending it to, you know, a handful of folks to be like, Hey, here's, here's the answer to the test for partnerships people right now, like, I truly believe this blueprint is the answer for bridging partnerships and sales like, once and for all right now and why nearby is different than partnering like, it is fundamentally isn't that we're putting where I think this is a helpful distinction, actually. Partnerships, teams, in sales teams have very different fundamental relationships with other partners or customers or your network. The partner team's job is to build trust. The sales team's job is to transact trust. It's a very dumb idea to have your partner team transacting trust, right? That's, that's you, we're talking deposits. And we're talking, you know, credits right there debits and credits, there's in and out, and if the same person is transacting and trying to build, it doesn't work. That's why an overlay motion, right partnerships not being a department and it being embedded is so important in where near bound comes in, is it is the guardrails in the governance for the what the partner team does, which is build, maintain and grow phenomenal partnerships, you know, build that reciprocity of what you want your sales team to do with CSMs, or with partner success managers. So build that same reciprocity in your own internal team. But with your sales team, that's the transaction layer, right? That's the that's the debit to the credits that you've been building. So you absolutely have to go to a place where you have this difference very clearly spelled out. And in the blueprint, that's where we go down to like, what that rhythm of the business should be, how do partner teams and sales teams operate. And I'm really excited about what I've broken down and kind of come up with here.

Isaac Morehouse 27:23
Again, this is why I think this is hitting home and and people are kind of flocking to it embracing this because it doesn't require you to go fire your sales team and hire a whole new sale a bunch of sellers who sell in a totally different way, who are thinking, they're not thinking transactionally they're thinking like, no, your sellers are going to sell and good sellers should know how to sell and to transact trust. But you can layer on to that, right, this component of, hey, sellers, you have a another tool in your toolkit, you have your buyers here, they need to be influenced by more than just you. Yeah, you're a part of that. But more than just you hear, here's a tool to bring in that influence that has been built and cultivated by those partnerships, teams, it's it's new, but it's not revolutionary, right doesn't require you to overthrow the old order.

Jared Fuller 28:15
And I'm a I'm about to go off here. So this is where you lean in folks. You don't have a better opportunity anywhere in your career or in partnerships than right now to go get some frickin W's on the board. What do I mean? Well, I mean, the right now today, your sales organization, let's say it is 5040 intent. They are spending, let's call it 4050 60% of our time, because we all know the outbound takes more time than responding to an inbound demo request, right? So at minimum, it's 40% of their time, that means eight hours in the day, what are they doing are supposed to be doing cold calls cold emails, so can your sales rep today, go to a website, go to LinkedIn, have a sales engagement tool, have some contact data, pull up contacts that are supposed to be there at the target accounts? And then they write a quote unquote, personalized outbound email? Do your sales reps do that today? Yes or no? The answer is yes. Okay. Do you think that some of those activities that they're already doing today would benefit from a play? That's very much like that outbound email? Except what we're doing is we're crafting something that's like, Hey, I noticed two months ago, you closed a deal with this company. In that deal, I noticed you were working with the ops department. Here's my context. I'm selling to the sales department as well, but ops has really been a blocker. I've heard quote, the ops team no longer has any bandwidth to work on this project this quarter. Right. I was hoping that you could forward them this note about how we work together and how it wouldn't be, you know, a blocker on the ops roadmap. Do you think you could forward this along If your sales team can write cold outbound messages with personalization and research, I promise I swear to God, that your sales team can do what I just said. And do you think that one of those activities versus the other is going to level up your business? The answer is yes. And every sales leader I've talked to goes, you're right. So my point is, in the point of this rant, is have the courage to go replace some of those outbound activities with near bound activities. And that's the by why it's by clarion call, you can go put W's on the board, when your company needs it. Now more than ever, it doesn't have to be through you begging for referrals. If that's the position you're in, in your Partnerships Program, you are apt. Oh,

Isaac Morehouse 30:42
you know, it's so funny. The twists and turns life and career take that I would not have expected my previous nonprofit work to be so relevant to some of this stuff. Because if you've ever if you've ever been on a nonprofit been a part of one, they have a board in a board of a nonprofit is like, usually people who donate a lot. But they're also like really bought in on the mission. And they're kind of there for guidance. But they're also they also have some kind of level, sometimes explicit, usually implicit commitment that they will help bring in certain amount of money, whether it's, they're wealthy, and they write checks themselves, or they just are connected to people, they're usually people who are very connected and have a good friends network. And people who work in fundraising at nonprofits. They know, they can just go out directly, and try to hit up people that they think would want to donate and support their cause. And they do that they do the outbound. But the majority is they work the board because the board doesn't do it themselves. They'll say, Sure, I'll help you raise money, and then they don't do anything. You have to actually actively go to them and be like, hey, board member, I was like, I did all the work for you. On the front end, I was researching this person, I think they might be good. I saw that, you know, you guys both donated to this other thing together. Maybe you know them? Would you be willing to plan a lunch meeting with me in them? Would you be willing to send them this book that we just published? Would you be willing to give me some advice on this email, I would like to send them you've got a board because I've seen nonprofits do this, we have an amazing board. That means they're gonna solve all of our funding problems, they're gonna raise money for us, right? If you've ever raised VC, you know that I got a lead investor, great, the rest of the rounds gonna fill itself, right? No, it doesn't. You have to work them in a way that makes them not feel used and abused, or they'll quit, but makes them feel excited and participatory with you. That's what it's like with partners, the sales team can go directly to people. But if you've got partners who have some level of relationship with you some level of formalized partnership with you to be able to tap into that and be like, let me go around the side. Let me hit it from multiple angles. Sure, I'll still go cold, I'll still go outbound. I'll still take inbound leads. But I'm also going to hit them from the flake with that Intel Intel intros and influence from the partners like, it's not that radical, but somehow these things have gotten have gotten separated too much.

Jared Fuller 33:03
It's it's the thing, like, the reason why I'm dying on this hill right now is I know what it's like to be on both sides of the table, and how challenging that is. And I really want to deliver W's to the market into the industry, like it is the partnerships moment that we we claimed we were going to have it's here. It's right here, it's right now. And I think that the near bound just allows us to cut through in this new round sales Blueprint was like, you know, going from theoretical ecosystem, you know, stability and emergence of systems, which I still want to geek out with you, you know, Isaac in the audience about is like, we have to respond to what's happening in the market. And what's happening in the market is people need the answers to the test, they need something they can go do right now with their sales team right now, this quarter. That gets to the top of that priority list that that that is piercingly clear to the problem, awareness. But then radically simple when it comes to like this illusion weariness. And that's what this blueprint is about. And so like, definitely check it out. I'll be dropping it on LinkedIn, we'll have it on the partner hacker site, probably the reveal site. I'm stoked for this blueprint to hit the market. And I definitely want your feedback and you think it's full of it, by all means, but I put in front of a lot of people. I've had a lot of sales leaders that were very skeptical of what I'm making that change of being solution weary. And same thing with partner people. And this is what the market is doing right now.

Isaac Morehouse 34:24
Yeah. And being able to do that crawl, walk, run like Okay, here you go. Here's a blueprint. Here's some very simple plays. Start with one of them. Start with one partner three part of the one rep, one exactly. One rep, and then take this, bring this to them fully baked, you've got the template, you got the setup. Hey, let's try this. Let's try Hey, how about here, here's something you can do on this deal. Right? So Jared, it almost sounded like we were talking I could almost hear you saying if you had one moment, one opportunity to capture everything you do. Once you capture it, that I do I genuinely feel like they're like the partnership role. The partnerships, you know, people in that role people who who have been partner pilled, they are genuinely sitting on the solution or a or a big part of the solution for their companies right now. And it's like, it's not an easy thing. But that's why if you can break it down to just the crawl, just crawl can influence bringing one deal into that closed one column because of a little bit of influence from a partner.

Jared Fuller 35:42
Yeah. And I think I think the the nuance of why running this as near bound sales and starting Intel influence intro in making the enemy is the outbound activity, not writ large, but a percentage of it that could be replaced, we're avoiding the conversation around partner source revenue. Right in partner attach becomes the thing that's most important, because you as the partner team, do not control partner source revenue as like the ultimate end all be all like, in fact, that's something that you have to bake into the sales organization, right? Like that partner source number needs to be governed by sales. Right? So near bound offers the guardrails to like, okay, Intel and influence are the ways that we can engage and activate partners intro is like, that's the hardest one. Right? But again, intros don't come unless salespeople ask for them. You know, like, sales leader, guess what, how many intros you're gonna get from partners? If your sales team doesn't ask for them? As many, as many as you probably think, as many is that your sales team is proactively giving to your partners? It's about none.

Isaac Morehouse 36:52
Yeah. Yeah. It's funny, like, departmental leaders often think in terms of systems and metrics and attribution. And of course, everybody, you know, ultimately, you got to try to get things to scale. And so it's easy to be like, well, if I can't come up with a way that I can easily say, at a at a grand scale, here's all the, here's all the definitively all the deals that were partner influence, or partner stores, and you start to think this big, like build a huge system level. But when you're in the trenches, when you're in your time, you know, how executives think they'll take something, they'll take an anecdote like, oh, my gosh, we just closed that deal right before the end of the quarter before the end of the month. And that wouldn't have happened if this partner hadn't been a part of it. And they're like, really? Do that again. Can we do that again? Right, it's like, just start there. Get it? So your execs are saying, Wait, what that deal won't have closed or wouldn't have closed as fast or wouldn't have been as big. If we didn't have this partner of Vault? How can we do more of that? And like worry about the big giant, perfectly measured system stuff later? I think almost starting with that qualitative thing? Like, can you answer the question affirmatively? Or can your sales team, Hey, show me a list of deals that we probably would not have closed? If it were not for a partner? Start there? If the answer is I can't tell you, well, then you're probably not doing it. If the answer is yeah, we've got a handful. I can't like prove it, prove it. But here look, in the conversation, they said this, right, or this email from a partner came and then the next day, they booked a call like, yeah, I don't think we would have closed that. That's like a great heuristic to start with, like, can you give an affirmative answer to that question, and often in wartime execs are looking for that. They're just like, cool, we can figure out attribution and measurement later, just helped me close more deals right now, you know,

Jared Fuller 38:38
you have to be able to show that the traction the results, and I mean, going back to that VP of sales enablement, that, that kind of stoked, this fire in me was like, you know, do do any of us in this room believe that if we hit this outbound activity target that we're going to get to our number at every executive said, No. And he's like, Oh, my gosh, right. So like, you know, this, I'm, I'm done. I'm over, I'm sick. Like I'm over this conversation once and for all, the only thing that is going to move the needle for us, His words, were an introduction, or influence from someone who already has a relationship with that account, bone, right. At the end of the day, that's the only thing only play that will move the needle, and partner people. You are the people right now today that can make that happen. That can answer that sentiment can make that realization, the things of why I'm harping on this language so much and trying to perfect this pitch, is that I truly believe that it's only going to come from you like you have to be the ones to go drive this change at this moment for your company, and how you approach that, as we all know, can be a multi year battle. Right? Whether that's like, hey design, the perfect partner, you know, like that ecosystem roadmap that I developed Isaac, that giant mural board. Yeah, but departments and all that, you know, people geeked out on that and liked it. But believe me, do not go put that in front of your CRO right now. Do not go put that in front of your CFO, like is a great piece, great asset. If you haven't seen it, go check out he's like, Oh, this is amazing. It lays out exactly how I should build my ecosystem. But stop, pause. What you say next matters, especially right now. And I think you know, this is the answers to the test. And I've been so excited talking with people about it, hammering it, like honing it, doing it with people, and then seeing these things flip into, you know, VPs of sales and CROs that showed up to a conversation where they'd say to me at the beginning of the call, I just had one shout out, I'll say Chris, I won't say the last name. Shout to Chris, because I know you listen. You put me in touch with his VP of sales. And the VP of Sales shows up to the call I kid you not. It was like, hey, you know, just FYI, I'm here. Because, you know, Chris brought me over. And like, you know, the focus is really on partner sourced, you know, dollars in deals. So if you can help us with that, that's what I really care about. And I was like, that's the exact opposite conversation that I showed up that I was not there to talk about partner source dollars, but at the end of the call, you know, this VP of Sales said, Okay, which team so we're going to pilot this with enterprise. Okay, perfect. So we're gonna do these five 710 reps. Okay, perfect. And then we're gonna go name these near bound accounts. And then we're going to run these plays. Perfect. Let's do it.

Isaac Morehouse 41:27
Yep. That like,

Jared Fuller 41:30
that's happening, right? VP of partnerships brings VP sales to combo. They're not they're speaking the different language, both problem aware solution, you know, weary. You know, the VP of partnerships is thinking, I can't take this to my VP of sales because she has 27 priorities. They're not going to prioritize this. The VP of sales is like, Hey, if you're not bringing me more source deals. I don't really, I don't have time for you. Yeah. And yet you sit them down, you have the right conversation time and time again, what's happening is, okay, let's pick these five accounts, these five E's, let's pull out 20% of their accounts that are in your bank accounts. Okay, let's go have them run these plays. Because guess what? The alternative is them just sending more outbound emails. It's work their art, you're replacing work they're already doing with work. That's more efficient.

Isaac Morehouse 42:13
Yes. Yes, that's it. Oh, I love it, man. I love it. And this, this blueprint is there for you for free. going live tomorrow on Oh, we're gonna publish it on your Yes, sir.

Jared Fuller 42:28
Nice. Nice. And then then the summit will be live by then to the announcement. Right? Yeah. Yep. So what was the what's the summit now? Isaac? Is it the pls summit 2023,

Isaac Morehouse 42:37
the near bound summit Bay, near bound Summit. Listen, we live in market, we learn out loud. And we learned from the market we learned with the market. And that PL X concept partner led everything was like, now you're hitting on something. It's not just a department, it's a strategy. It's an overlay. But calling it partner LED. It kind of like made it hard to reach those other departments and for them to grapple with and understand what that meant and why that was relevant to them why you want partner people to lead my department, you know, right. And, and the framing of near bound is like I get it. I understand outbound I understand inbound, I understand these are cross departmental strategies for go to market. I get near bound. And it's like, it allows us to pry that conversation open. And it's it's landing and it's hitting. And so like really just saying that's let's let's not deviate from what's working the words that people understand the framing that connects, let's roll with that, instead of just trying to be whatever is fun and cute and clever for marketing. Look, I love the x inside the little brackets, that's fine. There's a lot you can do with that from a design standpoint, making T shirts and stuff but but nearby news is the future. It's the future will and

Jared Fuller 43:54
it's a continuation of what we started, right. So nearby marketing, near bound sales day, you're bound success. So like, we're breaking this down for each department. And I think we're gonna approach it and reach a much wider and bigger audience get back. If you made it to this far on this episode, I'll drop this right here right now, because it's going to be live on the site is that, for example on marketing day, so nearby and marketing day, guess who are our key notice? I'm so stoked for this one of our keynotes, Chris Walker. Right. And Chris is probably the most prolific content creator, I'd say in b2b marketing right now. So like in terms of relevancy to the audience, we have probably the most socially relevant in terms of views, impressions and reach on social media keynoting nearby and marketing day. Chris is not a partner marketer, right? He's not from partner land. But he has a ton of great beliefs on why like dark social, and the reach with partners and working through your network and everything that we're talking about. He's like nearby and marketing is kind of the thing. So like, this does getting co signed by the main street, real quick people. So like, go check it out in your We'll have the blueprint that links to Get over to the summit to register as well. Get pre Reg, we're gonna have workbooks this year, it's going to be a blast. We have talent that I can't even talk to you about yet, but it's going to blow your mind live with experiences that like you've never seen in b2b before. We're bringing the hype back bigger and better than ever. And I feel really good about codifying everything we're doing Isaac, around near bound as an industry and in the thing that we started last year. Partnerships is a strategy, not a department making near bound the guardrails and the connective tissue for governing how these teams get to make their number right now and how you the partner person can be the hero in your company's journey. And that's why I ended the blueprint with my intro with this. Your company is counting on you.

Isaac Morehouse 45:45
Let's go

Jared Fuller 45:46
now you're COMM sign up. All right, folks, partner up, peace out. We will see you all next time.

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